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Pitching strategy question

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Pitching strategy question

Postby ja515y » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:29 pm

as of now I have 6 very solid starters. I've been trying to keep a close eye on my innings so I don't get too far ahead. Over the past month my pitchers have played so well I've had no other choice but to start them.
My question is how well does the strategy of using all your innings early and then trading your pitching work? right now I'm +50 and as long as my pitchers play well I plan on using them. Of course I've been shopping guys around looking for a nice deal, but I'm in no hurry because of the nice stats I'm getting.
My thought is as long as your getting good stats that's all that should matter right?
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Postby TheYanks04 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:34 pm

I find it hard to believe that with all th epitching woes around the majors and injuries, you have managed to draft and obtain no pitching "problems".

To answer your question though, trading pitchers after you burned up your innings is a TERRIBLE strategy that almost NEVER works. You are screwed and the whole league will know it if you are way over the limit. Why would I give you a good deal knowing you HAVE to deal? Of course you might find a moron or you might get a bidding war started with a few teams, but it is dodgey at best. As long as you are not too far over in your IP rate it is no big deal as injuries and slumps occur. 50 ove rthe limit is nothing to concern yourself with. If you are way over the rate, then you probably should look to deal now while players return optimum value and not when you are in a weak bargaining position.
Last edited by TheYanks04 on Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby orakana » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:36 pm

Yea, pitch them while they are good, it does no good to save innings til the end if your pitchers aren't going to be good then.

I'm actually 155 over the limit right now, but I did the math and I have 8.3 innings a day left over the rest of the season which is fine with me.

I look at this way, ride the hot horse while you can, over the season you'll sit guys with bad matchups, and toward the end of the season they may get less innings as they wear down and new guys come up. In the end it all evens out, don't worry about game usage until August.
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Postby ja515y » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:47 pm

That's true. I guess +50 isn't really that much. just sounds like it.
And I did have lots of pitching problems in the beginning of the year and have made some moves to get better.
R. Clemens (draft)
R. Halladay (trade)
R. Johnson (trade)
L. Hernandez (draft)
A. Pettitte (Waiver)
D. Haren (free agent)
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Postby sfbaseballfan » Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:05 pm

I was contemplating the same strategy. I'm in a roto league and I think it will work if you are leading all of the pitching categories by a large margin (which I am). By the end of the season you can trade those pitchers for some offensive studs. As long as you don't trade to someone who can use those players to catch you and you stay competitive in the offensive categories, I think the strategy can work.

I was starting everyone which cause me to be 100+ ip over. So I benched a couple of my startes when it looked like it was an unfavorable match-up and have paid the price because they happened to pitch some great games that day. Now I am only 27 ip over but I much rather of had those stats.
Lesson to be learn: Always Start Your ACES!!! ;-D
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Postby TheYanks04 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:12 pm

And just what idiot will trade you value when you run out of IPs in mid-August? First off you run into trading deadlines. Secondly, you run into the simple fact that you now have a roster full of unuseable players that you can't even cut as they would be used against you by opponents. So you have to sell on the cheap to someone.

It is a terrible idea to put yourself into a bind and into a weak bargaining position. You You have 10 pitchers putting up good stats you should pace it to use your top X number with favorable matchups and keep the others in reserve/for spot starts againt very weak opponents. That or deal them.
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Postby ja515y » Mon Jun 27, 2005 7:56 pm

the way I see it, even though you might be in a weak bargaining position with the person knowing you're over your innings limit. If the person your dealing with needs pitching, they are in just as much of a weak position. And especially if you don't have too bad of an offense, which I don't.
I now don't think I could use this strategy anyway. Being that +50 isn't as much as I thought, and I would probably have to pickup even more pitchers to really do it right. Which would be pretty stupid. Basicallly, this just gives me a nice trading tool. I'm still not in a hurry because my offense isn't too bad, I'm hovering around 3rd place, and I know there are teams that need pitching pretty bad.
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Postby bselig » Mon Jun 27, 2005 8:07 pm

Horrible strategy. There is a 162 game limit at batting positions. You can't bulk start batters once you trade your pitchers away, you can only make use of them for the measly number of games that are left. So what you've done is get normal value for your pitching - because there's no reason to think pitchers will be pitching substantially worse a month from now than they are now - and LOW value for your hitting. If you want to maximize what you have you package a pitcher with a batter to get a better batter now and have the benefit of him for the entire rest of the season. You don't burn away all your innings fast then trade for batters that only play a game a day at most. Terrible, horrible strategy. In my root league I am almost exactly on pace for innings, I play reliever-heavy to max out my strikeout potential, and carry five starters - which is one more than I have to carry - in case of injury. Without having any huge names other than Pedro my staff is a machine that is leading, and barring massive injury will continue to lead in almost every pitching category.
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Postby swyck » Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:02 pm

Fact is, innings are innings. There are only so many of them available. If you burn them up by August what difference does it make? ABSOLUTELY NONE! They dont count more in September then in July, do they? Use them up, as long as you use them up wisely. There is absolutely no possible reason to save innings whatsoever.

Anyone that tells you different needs to learn to count on their toes.

If I needed pitching and I knew you were out of innings, why does that matter? Your pitchers are available to everyone. If I want one I have to make a move, and make a good offer, otherwise someone else gets the pitcher.

As for the games played for batting positions, AGAIN WHY DOES THAT MATTER? It is true there are only so many games to go around, but why does it matter when they take place, as long as the games are optimized.

So what does this mean? If you want to burn innings early, save batting position games until later in the season when you can get some hot bats. Dont use any bats not red hot! Don't wait too long to start making (or accepting) offers.

Tough strat, but it can be worked if you got the stones for it, IMO.
B-)
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Postby TheYanks04 » Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:44 pm

You obviously have never been in trade hostile leagues, leagues filled with thieves, etc. If you really think that you can sell off someone for near value when the entire league knows you are in a bind you are kidding yourself. A few teams wil be out of the running and have ZIP to gain by trading with you for fair value. A few might be dead. And of the 3-5 teams left that may give a damn come mid-August most will likely be people who if they are in the running are not going to trade you Vladdy for Santana because the gain is marginal or may do them more harm than good. You will have to make it worth their while by giving them a bargain. Maybe you can play the top guys against each other, but it usually does not work that way.

And this all is so you can get a marginal upgrade in hitters as as was noted, there are offensive games played limits also usually.

You maximize your aces. If you have more pitchign than you can use you trade for upgrades that can be utilized the bulk of the season.
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