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Postby jblank » Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:56 pm

Yoda wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


He tossed 9 shut out innings with 6 Ks with his new team. A good pitching coach can do wonders. Just ask Doug Davis, Turnbow, Capuano, Santos, Obermueller, etc.


So did Mitre, so did countless other mediocre pitchers who dont become top starters. If you guys want to think that this is some epiphany and from now on he is gonna start striking people out rather than walking them and then pick up some pitches to strike people out, then go for him. I am skeptical and its gonna take more than one start for me to believe that he is gonna turn into a good pitcher, let alone a good fantasy pitcher.
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Postby jblank » Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:57 pm

RugbyD wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


this year's K/BB is way out of line with his career numbers and shouldn't continue as is.


True, but its also an indicator that trouble could be on the horizon, particularly when you factor in the park he WAS pitching in versus the park he IS pitching in.
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Postby Yoda » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:06 pm

jblank wrote:
RugbyD wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


this year's K/BB is way out of line with his career numbers and shouldn't continue as is.


True, but its also an indicator that trouble could be on the horizon, particularly when you factor in the park he WAS pitching in versus the park he IS pitching in.


So explain to us how he had a good season in 2003. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the home park that helped his numbers.

All I am saying is that he has a decent track record and Mike Maddux may be able to work his magic. Just watch his next couple of outings.
"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." ~George Carlin
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Postby reznorsboy » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:32 pm

I think this guy might turn out alright!! But I think I will wait a bit at least on emore start to see how he does.
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Postby jblank » Wed Jun 15, 2005 9:36 pm

Yoda wrote:
jblank wrote:
RugbyD wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


this year's K/BB is way out of line with his career numbers and shouldn't continue as is.


True, but its also an indicator that trouble could be on the horizon, particularly when you factor in the park he WAS pitching in versus the park he IS pitching in.


So explain to us how he had a good season in 2003. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the home park that helped his numbers.

All I am saying is that he has a decent track record and Mike Maddux may be able to work his magic. Just watch his next couple of outings.


8-o A good season in 2003? Does going 10-12 with a 4.16 ERA and a 1.40 WHIP with hitters hitting .292 equate to a good season in your book? Are you really calling that a good season? If anything that reinforces what we have been saying about him in here.
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Postby Scooter1027 » Thu Jun 16, 2005 12:06 am

WharfRat wrote:
Yoda wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


He tossed 9 shut out innings with 6 Ks with his new team. A good pitching coach can do wonders. Just ask Doug Davis, Turnbow, Capuano, Santos, Obermueller, etc.


Lesser pitchers have thrown shutouts. One game doesn't make a season. A good pitching coach can do wonders, you're right, but I don't think Ohka has the pure stuff to turn into anything but a back-end guy, as has been stated. Some of those other guys you mentioned throw gas, unlike Okha. The biggest thing for me is the inconsistency, and the fact that Milwaukee and Washington have two very different ballparks. Keep an eye on him, sure, but I wouldn't expect much.


No, only Turnbow throws gas out of that group. The rest are upper 80's/lower 90's kind of guys that Maddux has really coached into pitching to their strengths. He's gotten Doug Davis to focus on the cut fastball, Capuano on the changeup, and Santos on mixing up his pitches as much as possible since he throws quite a few different ones. Now, I don't know much about Ohka yet, but Maddux's track record leads me to believe that the more time Tomo spends in Milwaukee, the more he's going to learn and improve. I'd say he's definitely worth keeping an eye on.
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Postby Yoda » Thu Jun 16, 2005 12:52 am

jblank wrote:
Yoda wrote:
jblank wrote:
RugbyD wrote:
jblank wrote:
Fpower wrote:His WHIP is respectable, so he can't be stranding that many baserunners, can he?

And shouldn't he have more run support in Milwaukee?


Do you guys even look at stats and history? He has 10 more walks than K's, a recipe for disaster. He has no real out pitch, he has very little velocity, and no history that suggests he is any more than back of the rotation fodder. He also just left arguably the best pitchers park in Baseball. If all of the above sounds groovy to you, then snatch him.


this year's K/BB is way out of line with his career numbers and shouldn't continue as is.


True, but its also an indicator that trouble could be on the horizon, particularly when you factor in the park he WAS pitching in versus the park he IS pitching in.


So explain to us how he had a good season in 2003. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the home park that helped his numbers.

All I am saying is that he has a decent track record and Mike Maddux may be able to work his magic. Just watch his next couple of outings.


8-o A good season in 2003? Does going 10-12 with a 4.16 ERA and a 1.40 WHIP with hitters hitting .292 equate to a good season in your book? Are you really calling that a good season? If anything that reinforces what we have been saying about him in here.


Much to learn have you. Keep an eye on him you must. ;-D
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Postby jblank » Thu Jun 16, 2005 1:25 am

Pardner, I have been in or around Baseball for over 20 years, in some sort of capacity, and I can honestly say that if you think his '03 season qualifies as a "good season" then your perception of what is good or bad might need to be adjusted.
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Postby Yoda » Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:08 am

jblank wrote:Pardner, I have been in or around Baseball for over 20 years, in some sort of capacity, and I can honestly say that if you think his '03 season qualifies as a "good season" then your perception of what is good or bad might need to be adjusted.


You know what? I was referring to 02 not 03. He doesn't K a ton but he CAN be a very effective pitcher if you look at his career numbers. If a pitcher like Ohka is not worth keeping an eye on, then I honestly do not know who else would be. You tell me.
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Postby max1889 » Thu Jun 16, 2005 4:38 pm

I would avoid him like a plague. I remember watching him in Boston when he would just get demolished. It was painful to watch him go out there every 5 days and have another bad start. Looking at his numbers, I don't see any reason to be excited about him.
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