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Dunn and Billy Wagner to be traded?

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Postby RugbyD » Fri May 27, 2005 3:06 pm

that's more like it. ;-D
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Postby bselig » Fri May 27, 2005 3:18 pm

I am stunned that there are people who think Patterson is better or will be better than Dunn. Really, just shocked. Patterson is a 5'9" 180 lbs guy who steps to the plate, tries to hit homers, k's a ton and doesn't walk. Dunn is a 6'5" 270 lbs guy who steps to the plate, actually hits homers, k's a ton and does walk. Really, I'm shocked. Shocked.
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Postby RugbyD » Fri May 27, 2005 3:41 pm

bselig wrote:I am stunned that there are people who think Patterson is better or will be better than Dunn. Really, just shocked. Patterson is a 5'9" 180 lbs guy who steps to the plate, tries to hit homers, k's a ton and doesn't walk. Dunn is a 6'5" 270 lbs guy who steps to the plate, actually hits homers, k's a ton and does walk. Really, I'm shocked. Shocked.


but, but, but,
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Postby RugbyD » Fri May 27, 2005 5:19 pm

to intentionally beat a dead horse, CP has 10 HRs this year, all solo. MVP!MVP!MVP!
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Postby reznorsboy » Fri May 27, 2005 7:18 pm

Why does everybody always praise Dunn so much? He basically hits a homer or strikes out and doesn't bring much more to the table.

Corey Patterson has many different tools. He may not be as good a hitter as Dunn but He is an excellent fielder. Do you guys not agree that having a defensively sound center fielder makes all the difference in the world to a team. He is fast and has a decent arm which is rare these days.
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Postby quietstorm » Fri May 27, 2005 7:42 pm

reznorsboy wrote:Why does everybody always praise Dunn so much? He basically hits a homer or strikes out and doesn't bring much more to the table.

Corey Patterson has many different tools. He may not be as good a hitter as Dunn but He is an excellent fielder. Do you guys not agree that having a defensively sound center fielder makes all the difference in the world to a team. He is fast and has a decent arm which is rare these days.

You're forgetting that Dunn is also a monster when it comes to OBA. He gets on base more than most outfielders, and walks more than anybody but Bonds. Sure, he Ks a lot, but look at it this way: He Ks because he has a good eye. He sees a ball that's three inches off the plate and isn't good for him to hit, and it gets called a strike.

"I see the ball too well, that's my problem. I see a pitch that might be four, five inches outside and it looks unhittable, but a lot of umpires will call that because it's so close."
--Adam Dunn

This is not a bad thing. Unlike Vlad Guerrero, who swings at everything, Dunn is patient. Would you rather have him getting a bunch of GIDPs? I should think not! A strikeout is better than any other sort of out, because you don't take the chance of getting a double play.

And let's look at OBP. Guerrero's OBP is .361. Dunn's is .407. I know we're talking about Patterson, but look at that; Dunn gets on base far more often than the guy who is considered by many to be the best hitter in the AL.

How about we look at WARP, continuing our Guerrero comparison:

2005
Dunn: 2.9
Guerrero: 2.4
Patterson: 1.5

2004
Dunn: 6.6
Guerrero: 9.1
Patterson: 4.8

Okay, so Guerrero has a higher established value than Dunn. But Patterson doesn't.

And, Patterson's best OBA, in 2003, was .329. That's been dropping ever since.

Also worth nothing... so far this year, Patterson's fielding RAA is 2. Dunn's is 0. Last year, Dunn was -16 versus the 2 of Patterson. Patterson is barely above average in the field. Yes, Dunn is below average, but his hitting more than makes up for it, as his WARP value shows ;)

Why would somebody want Patterson over Dunn?
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Postby RugbyD » Fri May 27, 2005 7:53 pm

what i find hilarious in all this is that Dunn is a far superior leadoff hitter to Patterson, not to mention anywhere else in the lineup.
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Postby The Jury » Fri May 27, 2005 8:12 pm

RugbyD wrote:what i find hilarious in all this is that Dunn is a far superior leadoff hitter to Patterson, not to mention anywhere else in the lineup.


HAHHAHA I just thought about that and it's hilarious!!!!! :-D
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Postby Trot Nixon » Fri May 27, 2005 8:23 pm

I would love to see Sean Casey make his way over to the Sox ;-D
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Postby Members Only Jackets » Fri May 27, 2005 8:36 pm

who will close for Philli if Wagner is gone?
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