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Postby citti34 » Sat May 14, 2005 11:46 am

Jones is gross, I have him, and he's not a closer. Have any you watched this guy. :~(
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Postby warrick95 » Sat May 14, 2005 12:35 pm

GSes wrote:no there is really no chance of Mota not returning to the closer role almost immediateky upon return.

sorry to the optmistic todd jones owners but he will not keep the the job, and in fact he isnt even very good. he been good so far this year, but his track record says he is not even close to being capable of a ML closer.

anyways Mota was doing fine before he got hurt, just the fish gave him no save opps.

anyone who thinks he isnt gonna reclaim his closer role is oviously not up to date.

the only way Todd Jones gets saves once mot returns is

mota gets hurt again
or
mota completely implodes.............and there is no sign of that happening.


No, I'm not an optimistic Jones owner. I picked up Jones in NO leagues even though I could. He's a timebomb waiting to explode. In fact, I do have Mota in a couple.

Also, Mota getting hurt again is not out of the realm of possibilities at all. Poor Guillermo had a very heavy workload in the past couple of years.

Cornbread, I don't know if FLA is exactly win now, though. Even though they can win now, they have an extremely bright future. Not only do they have their "Big Three," which, barring injuries, will be spectacular in a few years (they must retain them, of course), one of the brightest young hitters in the game in Miguel Cabrera, Lowell locked up longterm, Pierre wreaking havoc at the top, and a good farm system. Jeremy Hermida projects to be a solid #2 type hitter (well, he did before this season. he's jacking homers left and right now...he may be a middle of the order guy now) and Scott Olsen is a top lefty. They probably CAN win now (and want to since they signed Delgado), but they can win later, too.
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Postby Strasil42 » Sat May 14, 2005 3:03 pm

Cornbread Maxwell wrote:actually - he has about a 50% conversion rate in save opps - so you guys go ahead and keep ignoring me when I say his hold on the closer situation is shakey.

Good pitchers do not always have the makeup to close. FLA management knows this. Thats why they went out and got 2 guys who have been successful as closers as insurance policies in case Mota is one of those good pitchers who cannot transition into a good closer.


Why would you use a sample size so small to make your point? Mota will be floridas closer all year when healthy.
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Postby The Cow » Sat May 14, 2005 3:44 pm

McKeon being that he is 70+ years old may stick with the vet in Jones. The most likely scenario is that Mota gets his old job back, BUT he will be on a shorter leash. Jones will get some save chances as Mota just won't pitch as frequently with the elbow. This is starting to smell like well like............................................gulp.........closer by committee!!!!!!!! and nobody likes that scenario. McKeon did say at the start of the year that his bullpen may be a closer by committee. Being a Jones owner I am pulling for him, hey even a committee is better than pure set-up. BUT if I were a Mota owner I would shop the guy as soon as he saves a couple, because he may lose the job or go committee or get hurt. Lets put it this way I am happier owning Bob Wickman than Mota.

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Postby GSes » Sat May 14, 2005 5:30 pm

The Cow wrote:McKeon being that he is 70+ years old may stick with the vet in Jones. The most likely scenario is that Mota gets his old job back, BUT he will be on a shorter leash. Jones will get some save chances as Mota just won't pitch as frequently with the elbow. This is starting to smell like well like............................................gulp.........closer by committee!!!!!!!! and nobody likes that scenario. McKeon did say at the start of the year that his bullpen may be a closer by committee. Being a Jones owner I am pulling for him, hey even a committee is better than pure set-up. BUT if I were a Mota owner I would shop the guy as soon as he saves a couple, because he may lose the job or go committee or get hurt. Lets put it this way I am happier owning Bob Wickman than Mota.

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are u joking???

wut makes u ppl think Jones is going to stay the closer over Mota????????????

he is 2/2 in save opps
1.86 ERA

am i missing something? or are u guys retarded, b/c those are successful numbers.


and you say he was bad when he was FLA's closer last year, Benitz only missed 15 days, so that 15 day frame is not enough to judge his closer performance.

and while he did post an ERA of 4.81 with the fish last year, his whip was 1.01 and opp hit .200 so the ERA was a fluke compared to his other numbers.

There is absolutely NO evidence to suggest that
Mota is bad
Mota won't close upon return
Mota will lost the job upon return
or that TODD JONES? is a better option then Mota, thats ludacris.

Mota will come back next weeek and save 30-35 game over the rest of the year and end up with 33-37 saves
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Postby great gretzky » Sat May 14, 2005 5:33 pm

how many seasons do you have to have under your belt before you are a "vet"?
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Postby beezer » Sat May 14, 2005 5:55 pm

Mota will be the closer when he returns, but, everyone is overlooking the the fact that he might have health issues for the rest of the year. He threw a TON of innings last year with the Dodgers. I saw him pitch earlier this year and he didn't have nearly the velocity he had last year. It will be interesting to see how it is when he returns. If it is still down, there could more more problems down the road.
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Postby Cornbread Maxwell » Sat May 14, 2005 7:08 pm

Strasil42 wrote:
Cornbread Maxwell wrote:actually - he has about a 50% conversion rate in save opps - so you guys go ahead and keep ignoring me when I say his hold on the closer situation is shakey.

Good pitchers do not always have the makeup to close. FLA management knows this. Thats why they went out and got 2 guys who have been successful as closers as insurance policies in case Mota is one of those good pitchers who cannot transition into a good closer.


Why would you use a sample size so small to make your point? Mota will be floridas closer all year when healthy.


Because good setup men sometimes cannot transition into good closers. Thats the entire point. When Mota did become a closer last yr he was 3 for 7 - of course thats a small sample size, but its enough to draw up red flags. The argument that he is a good ML closer has to use an even smaller sample size.

Warrick - I know Burnett has a 1 yr deal, but what about Beckett, Willis, and Leiber - how long are they signed for? Actually - do you know how long Cabrera is signed for too?
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Postby Mookie4ever » Sat May 14, 2005 7:24 pm

Nobody knows for sure but I believe that the fish will ease Mota back into the closers role. They certainly will not give him a huge workload, what with the inflamed elbow and all, but I also don't think that they will take the job away from him because of injury.

At the end of the day FLA will use whoever is more effective. They don't have a lot invested in either. Neither is under contract for next year and Mota's performance bonuses for this year are very small. So whoever does the job will get the chances but Mota will certainly get an opportunity.
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Postby Laean » Sat May 14, 2005 8:32 pm

GSes wrote:
The Cow wrote:McKeon being that he is 70+ years old may stick with the vet in Jones. The most likely scenario is that Mota gets his old job back, BUT he will be on a shorter leash. Jones will get some save chances as Mota just won't pitch as frequently with the elbow. This is starting to smell like well like............................................gulp.........closer by committee!!!!!!!! and nobody likes that scenario. McKeon did say at the start of the year that his bullpen may be a closer by committee. Being a Jones owner I am pulling for him, hey even a committee is better than pure set-up. BUT if I were a Mota owner I would shop the guy as soon as he saves a couple, because he may lose the job or go committee or get hurt. Lets put it this way I am happier owning Bob Wickman than Mota.

Cow



are u joking???

wut makes u ppl think Jones is going to stay the closer over Mota????????????

he is 2/2 in save opps
1.86 ERA

am i missing something? or are u guys retarded, b/c those are successful numbers.


and you say he was bad when he was FLA's closer last year, Benitz only missed 15 days, so that 15 day frame is not enough to judge his closer performance.

and while he did post an ERA of 4.81 with the fish last year, his whip was 1.01 and opp hit .200 so the ERA was a fluke compared to his other numbers.

There is absolutely NO evidence to suggest that
Mota is bad
Mota won't close upon return
Mota will lost the job upon return
or that TODD JONES? is a better option then Mota, thats ludacris.

Mota will come back next weeek and save 30-35 game over the rest of the year and end up with 33-37 saves


i believe that chances are mota will close this year too, but your post had some problems.

1. no need to call anyone retarded. that just makes you look immature.

2. you say mota's 15 days of latroy hawkins imitation last year is too small a sample to warrant giving weight to, but then you throw out that he is 2/2/ in save chances with sub 2.00 era this year like that's a large sample?

3. you complain about people making assumptions, but then you make some yourself saying he WILL save 33-37.
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