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Mariners talking "shake up."

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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Thu May 12, 2005 10:57 pm

SouthBronxBombers wrote:I think you can count the number of 18 year old kids who have pitched decently in the majors at 0. There is no reason whatsoever to pull this kid up to the majors right now. He has control problems, and major league hitters are not Class A hitters. There is no reason to take the risk of screwing him by bringing him up. Especially if you are doing so with the intent on his becoming the person the pennant hinges on. You're almost guaranteeing failure on his end.


Jim Brillheart
Bill Miller
Mike McCormick
Ed Knouff
Larry Dierker
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Postby thehat » Fri May 13, 2005 3:36 am

Felix Hernandez should (and most likely will) come up in September for a taste. He should stay where he is till then...unless he suddenly becomes completely unhittable and forces the callup. For now, he's still mastering AAA and until the control issues are ironed out, there's now way he should be with the big club.
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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Fri May 13, 2005 7:08 am

GotowarMissAgnes wrote:
SouthBronxBombers wrote:I think you can count the number of 18 year old kids who have pitched decently in the majors at 0. There is no reason whatsoever to pull this kid up to the majors right now. He has control problems, and major league hitters are not Class A hitters. There is no reason to take the risk of screwing him by bringing him up. Especially if you are doing so with the intent on his becoming the person the pennant hinges on. You're almost guaranteeing failure on his end.


Jim Brillheart
Bill Miller
Mike McCormick
Ed Knouff
Larry Dierker


Can't believe I forgot this one...guy by the name of Feller.
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Postby Sticky Spice » Fri May 13, 2005 7:38 am

What we need more than Felix is a healthy Madritsch.

Get well soon, Bobby! ;-D
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Postby SouthBronxBombers » Fri May 13, 2005 9:52 am

I stand corrected on Feller.

Brillheart pitched a total of four years with a lifetime losing record.
There is no Bill Miller that I can find that made his debut at the age of 18.
Mike McCormack did nothing until his third year.
Ed Knouff won a grand total of 20 games in the 1880's.
Dierker also did not do anything until his third year.

Feller's only remarkable event prior to his third year was striking out 17 in one game. He had no real impact until then, but I will say he did pitch decently at that age. The others did not.
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Postby Y`s Guy » Fri May 13, 2005 1:16 pm

It looks like Jorge Campillo may be the option that the Mariners go with if he pitches well vs. the Isoptopes tomorrow...

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/baseball/224074_mbok13.html
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Postby mcqfesijiba » Fri May 13, 2005 5:51 pm

Whether or not Felix is ready for the Bigs yet still doesn't stop him from being a better option than most of the rotation they already have. Heck, he might even be their best starter right now with the way their current starters are going. I'm sure they WANT to hold back on bringing him up, but given their SP issues he'll definitely be up soon.
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Postby GotowarMissAgnes » Fri May 13, 2005 8:28 pm

SouthBronxBombers wrote:I stand corrected on Feller.

Brillheart pitched a total of four years with a lifetime losing record.
There is no Bill Miller that I can find that made his debut at the age of 18.
Mike McCormack did nothing until his third year.
Ed Knouff won a grand total of 20 games in the 1880's.
Dierker also did not do anything until his third year.

Feller's only remarkable event prior to his third year was striking out 17 in one game. He had no real impact until then, but I will say he did pitch decently at that age. The others did not.


Your statement was not how many guys went on to great careers. Your statement was: "I think you can count the number of 18 year old kids who have pitched decently in the majors at 0."

The criteria is pitching decently at age 18:
Brillheart pitched almost 120 innings with a 3.61 ERA, 7 percent better than the league average.
Bob (sorry) Miller pitched 70 innings in relief at age 18 with an ERA of 2.45, 50% better than league average.
Mike McCormack pitched 75 innings with a 4.10 ERA, just 4 percent below league average.
Ed Knouff pitched 106 innings at age 17 with a 3.65 ERA, just 6 percent below league average.
Dierker pitched almost 150 innings with a 3.50 ERA, just 4 percent below league average.

At age 18 or younger all 5 of these pitchers and Feller pitched decently in the majors. It's certainly unusual for that to happen and it's certainly no guarantee of long-term success, and it certainly can be risky for a young player to be pitching at that age in the majors.

But, I was just responding to your statement that no one had ever pitched decently in the majors at age 18. That's not true.
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