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Utley vs Uribe....

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Postby TheRawDAWG » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:05 pm

slomo007 wrote:
Secret Avatar wrote:"I'd take Utley because he has more upside IMO (possibility for 25 homers if he plays consistently)."

I don't understand this logic. Uribe hit 23 HR last year in only 500 at-bats and with a 282 BA. Why would you want the "possibility" when you can have a guy who has already done it and has a good chance to do even better with more at-bats?

A big upside for Uribe may be the potential to bat 2nd. Right now, Iguchi has that slot, but there's a real possibility that he loses it and Uribe slides in. Uribe has got some speed and would do well in the 2-hole. In the 2-hole, a line for Uribe like 290-30-100-100-15 is a real possibility. That's light-years beyond what Utley can put up, IMO.


I don't know about the 100 RBIs, but .290, 100 runs, 30, 15 SBs is not that much of a stretch if he hit 2nd all year long. However, I am definitely not expecting that at all. I'd settle for .280, 20, 10 to be honest.


Why isn't it being said that Uribe did this with Colorado? How many times have we seen players coming off great years in colorado sign a contract and stink it up with their new team? Uribe wont hit 30 homers and will be lucky to hit 20 this year. Nowhere close to 100 RBIs, and an aberage of .280. IF he hits second he could score 100 runs. But right now thats not going to happen.

Utley, wont be spectacular either. But her has a much better chance at 30 dingers. Wont score many runs if he's hitting 8th however. but should hit for a decent average of .280.

All in all, very close players. Uribe has all the position eligibility which is a bonus. But I'd take Utley cause I don't trust Uribe's numbers from last season at all.
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Postby StlSluggers » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:11 pm

I still think Utley will be better long term. I think he can be a .280/30/100 guy as early as next year. I don't have that kind of faith in Uribe.
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Postby CubsFan7724 » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:11 pm

TheRawDAWG wrote:
slomo007 wrote:
Secret Avatar wrote:"I'd take Utley because he has more upside IMO (possibility for 25 homers if he plays consistently)."

I don't understand this logic. Uribe hit 23 HR last year in only 500 at-bats and with a 282 BA. Why would you want the "possibility" when you can have a guy who has already done it and has a good chance to do even better with more at-bats?

A big upside for Uribe may be the potential to bat 2nd. Right now, Iguchi has that slot, but there's a real possibility that he loses it and Uribe slides in. Uribe has got some speed and would do well in the 2-hole. In the 2-hole, a line for Uribe like 290-30-100-100-15 is a real possibility. That's light-years beyond what Utley can put up, IMO.


I don't know about the 100 RBIs, but .290, 100 runs, 30, 15 SBs is not that much of a stretch if he hit 2nd all year long. However, I am definitely not expecting that at all. I'd settle for .280, 20, 10 to be honest.


Why isn't it being said that Uribe did this with Colorado? How many times have we seen players coming off great years in colorado sign a contract and stink it up with their new team? Uribe wont hit 30 homers and will be lucky to hit 20 this year. Nowhere close to 100 RBIs, and an aberage of .280. IF he hits second he could score 100 runs. But right now thats not going to happen.

Utley, wont be spectacular either. But her has a much better chance at 30 dingers. Wont score many runs if he's hitting 8th however. but should hit for a decent average of .280.

All in all, very close players. Uribe has all the position eligibility which is a bonus. But I'd take Utley cause I don't trust Uribe's numbers from last season at all.

He played for the White Sox last year, genius, and he still plays there. Players at the Cell are always cash money hitters. I like both, but Uribe has done it before, and he probably ends up with similar numbers as Utley as long as hes with the White Sox. Plus he gets SS and 3B eligibility also.
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Postby wrveres » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:20 pm

Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.
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Postby StlSluggers » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:21 pm

Nat Uralice wrote:for the record, I'd take Utley because he has more upside IMO (possibility for 25 homers if he plays consistently). Uribe is too streaky. That being said, I'd still take Uribe, but I'd rather have Chase.

Did you just say that you'd take both over the other???

:*)

Anyway, I have the Utley batting behind Thome:

Rollins
Byrd
Abreu
Burrell
Thome
Utley
Lieberthal
Bell
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Postby StlSluggers » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:29 pm

wrveres wrote:Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.

You think? I have to imagine that the only reason Polanco hasn't been traded yet is because they want him as Utley insurance. If Utley's not a total disappointment for 4, 6 or maybe 8 weeks, I think the Phils start shopping Polanco around. He's good enough to start for some teams, and they could get a decent return for him, I think.

BTW, is Bell on/going on the DL? If so, won't Polanco be playing 3B for a while?
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Postby wrveres » Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:42 pm

StlSluggers wrote:
wrveres wrote:Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.

You think? I have to imagine that the only reason Polanco hasn't been traded yet is because they want him as Utley insurance. If Utley's not a total disappointment for 4, 6 or maybe 8 weeks, I think the Phils start shopping Polanco around. He's good enough to start for some teams, and they could get a decent return for him, I think.

BTW, is Bell on/going on the DL? If so, won't Polanco be playing 3B for a while?

I do actually, and there is a couple of reasons for my thinking.

A) Philly is excepted to contend this year. All of the local papers and team management have made it clear that all of their excuses are gone.

B) Utley doesn't exactly hit left handers very well. Only 1 HR and 5 Career RBIs. Chase's career .228 against lefties vs Polancos career .326 is a sure sign of a platoon situation developing.

C) Sure Polanco will gets his AB's at 3rd, but if they plan on trading Polanco, they are going to need to showcase him.
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Postby JTWood » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:24 pm

wrveres wrote:
StlSluggers wrote:
wrveres wrote:Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.

You think? I have to imagine that the only reason Polanco hasn't been traded yet is because they want him as Utley insurance. If Utley's not a total disappointment for 4, 6 or maybe 8 weeks, I think the Phils start shopping Polanco around. He's good enough to start for some teams, and they could get a decent return for him, I think.

BTW, is Bell on/going on the DL? If so, won't Polanco be playing 3B for a while?

I do actually, and there is a couple of reasons for my thinking.

A) Philly is excepted to contend this year. All of the local papers and team management have made it clear that all of their excuses are gone.

B) Utley doesn't exactly hit left handers very well. Only 1 HR and 5 Career RBIs. Chase's career .228 against lefties vs Polancos career .326 is a sure sign of a platoon situation developing.

C) Sure Polanco will gets his AB's at 3rd, but if they plan on trading Polanco, they are going to need to showcase him.

But you do agree that Polanco should be trade bait if Utley isn't a total failure, right? In that case, even in your scenario, Utley is at peak value by mid-season.
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Postby wrveres » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:28 pm

JTWood wrote:
wrveres wrote:
StlSluggers wrote:
wrveres wrote:Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.

You think? I have to imagine that the only reason Polanco hasn't been traded yet is because they want him as Utley insurance. If Utley's not a total disappointment for 4, 6 or maybe 8 weeks, I think the Phils start shopping Polanco around. He's good enough to start for some teams, and they could get a decent return for him, I think.

BTW, is Bell on/going on the DL? If so, won't Polanco be playing 3B for a while?

I do actually, and there is a couple of reasons for my thinking.

A) Philly is excepted to contend this year. All of the local papers and team management have made it clear that all of their excuses are gone.

B) Utley doesn't exactly hit left handers very well. Only 1 HR and 5 Career RBIs. Chase's career .228 against lefties vs Polancos career .326 is a sure sign of a platoon situation developing.

C) Sure Polanco will gets his AB's at 3rd, but if they plan on trading Polanco, they are going to need to showcase him.

But you do agree that Polanco should be trade bait if Utley isn't a total failure, right? In that case, even in your scenario, Utley is at peak value by mid-season.


sure, but people are drafting Chase like he is going to get a full seasons worth of AB's and I am saying he wont.

IMO, Chase and Placido are about the same ballplayer right now. Chase has more upside sure, but he isn't going to realize that upside until he can hit lefties consistantly.
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Postby perlick29 » Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:35 pm

wrveres wrote:
JTWood wrote:
wrveres wrote:
StlSluggers wrote:
wrveres wrote:Not to mention all of those AB's that Polanco is going to steal from Utley.

You think? I have to imagine that the only reason Polanco hasn't been traded yet is because they want him as Utley insurance. If Utley's not a total disappointment for 4, 6 or maybe 8 weeks, I think the Phils start shopping Polanco around. He's good enough to start for some teams, and they could get a decent return for him, I think.

BTW, is Bell on/going on the DL? If so, won't Polanco be playing 3B for a while?

I do actually, and there is a couple of reasons for my thinking.

A) Philly is excepted to contend this year. All of the local papers and team management have made it clear that all of their excuses are gone.

B) Utley doesn't exactly hit left handers very well. Only 1 HR and 5 Career RBIs. Chase's career .228 against lefties vs Polancos career .326 is a sure sign of a platoon situation developing.

C) Sure Polanco will gets his AB's at 3rd, but if they plan on trading Polanco, they are going to need to showcase him.

But you do agree that Polanco should be trade bait if Utley isn't a total failure, right? In that case, even in your scenario, Utley is at peak value by mid-season.


sure, but people are drafting Chase like he is going to get a full seasons worth of AB's and I am saying he wont.

IMO, Chase and Placido are about the same ballplayer right now. Chase has more upside sure, but he isn't going to realize that upside until he can hit lefties consistantly.


I still say Chase will get 450 AB's even with polanco. Ill wager the vanilla milkshake you owe me that chase puts up better numbers.
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