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The new NL pitchers are great value.

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Postby NZF » Thu Sep 01, 2005 11:45 pm

RAmst23 wrote:
I can't believe it took until the 2nd page of this thread for someone to bring up the Win Loss of Interleague play.


:-? Why is that?

The thread originally had nothing to do with interleague play, it was only mentioned at the end of the first page.

Also, I don't believe the real talent (especially hitters) will jump around between leagues. Many of the so called elite hitters are given long term contracts.
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Postby Pogotheostrich » Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:38 am

New Zealand Fan wrote:Also, I don't believe the real talent (especially hitters) will jump around between leagues. Many of the so called elite hitters are given long term contracts.
Most elite hitters won't move much but why does it have to be elite hitters. Great young players are always going to be coming up and hitting free agency. Older players get worse and retire. Change happens constantly. It doesn't take long for one league to catch up and/or pass the other league.

NL pitchers will always be a better value because they don't have to face the DH.
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Postby NZF » Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:32 am

Pogotheostrich wrote: Most elite hitters won't move much but why does it have to be elite hitters.


It doesn't, it's just who DK used to compare the relative league strengths and who RAmst23 used as an example with players swapping leagues.

Of the Top 10 hitters in the majors, arguably 7-8 are from the AL and will be there for years to come.
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Postby DK » Sun Sep 04, 2005 5:57 pm

Of the Top 10 hitters in the majors, arguably 7-8 are from the AL and will be there for years to come.


Just going by OPS, the top 10 hitters (min. 120 games) are:

Lee
Pujols
A-Rod
Ortiz
Cabrera
Manny
Ensberg
Jones
Bay
Dunn

That's three from the AL and seven from the NL. Of the three from the AL, none of them are under 30. If you loosen the strings a bit, Delgado, Hafner, and Giambi would all make it on the list but again, none of them are under 30 years old. So how would they be there for "years to come", as compared to Pujols, Cabrera, Ensberg, Jones, Bay, Dunn, etc.?
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Postby NZF » Sun Sep 04, 2005 6:57 pm

Who's not listening now ;-7

I'll say it again, you can't fairly use OPS to compare them because they're not facing the same pitchers.

Putting Ensberg, Dunn and Andruw Jones ahead of Sheffield, Tejada and Vlad as hitters just because they happen to have a better OPS in 5/6th of a season is ludicrous.

And by years to come I don't mean 10-15 years down the track, I mean over the next few years. It's a crapshoot to evaluate the relative league strengths after that point.
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Postby Absolutely Adequate » Sun Sep 04, 2005 8:43 pm

New Zealand Fan wrote:Who's not listening now ;-7

I'll say it again, you can't fairly use OPS to compare them because they're not facing the same pitchers.

Putting Ensberg, Dunn and Andruw Jones ahead of Sheffield, Tejada and Vlad as hitters just because they happen to have a better OPS in 5/6th of a season is ludicrous.

And by years to come I don't mean 10-15 years down the track, I mean over the next few years. It's a crapshoot to evaluate the relative league strengths after that point.


Why can't you compare the two leagues using OPS? It's true that they don't have the same exact pitchers, but the law of averages tells us that they are similar enough that your argument is empty.
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Postby NZF » Sun Sep 04, 2005 8:55 pm

Absolutely Adequate wrote:
Why can't you compare the two leagues using OPS? It's true that they don't have the same exact pitchers, but the law of averages tells us that they are similar enough that your argument is empty.


What argument is that?
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Postby Absolutely Adequate » Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:16 pm

New Zealand Fan wrote:
Absolutely Adequate wrote:
Why can't you compare the two leagues using OPS? It's true that they don't have the same exact pitchers, but the law of averages tells us that they are similar enough that your argument is empty.


What argument is that?



This one:

I'll say it again, you can't fairly use OPS to compare them because they're not facing the same pitchers.
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Postby NZF » Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:31 pm

OK, so using career OPS would be an even fairer way to assess the overall quality of both leagues, wouldn't it?
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Postby davidmarver » Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:36 pm

New Zealand Fan wrote:OK, so using career OPS would be an even fairer way to assess the overall quality of both leagues, wouldn't it?

How? Many players cross leagues, which would skew the data immensely.
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