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Interesting H2H strategy

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Interesting H2H strategy

Postby cinquad » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:16 pm

Just drafted in a yahoo H2H normal 5x5 league. There was one guy (who was at the draft, so this wasn't auto-pick or anything) who took pitchers through the first 12-13 rounds. I had actually begun to suspect collusion, but it didn't look like it. Then he picked bargan SB-heavy hitters through the end of the draft. His team looks like this:

SP R. Johnson (NYY - SP)
SP P. Martínez (NYM - SP)
RP M. Rivera (NYY - RP)
RP A. Benítez (SF - RP)
P R. Clemens (Hou - SP)
P C. Pavano (NYY - SP)
P T. Hoffman (SD - RP)
BN C. Carpenter (StL - SP)
BN G. Maddux (ChC - SP)
BN M. Buehrle (CWS - SP)
BN Ja. Wright (NYY - SP)
C J. Kendall (Oak - C)
1B B. Wilkerson (Was - 1B,OF)
2B R. Freel (Cin - 2B,3B,OF)
3B S. Hillenbrand (Tor - 1B,3B)
SS C. Izturis (LAD - SS)
OF M. Lawton (Pit - OF)
OF C. Crisp (Cle - OF)
OF R. Sanders (StL - OF)
Util M. Kotsay (Oak - OF)
BN E. Byrnes (Oak - OF)

It looks like he's betting on being able to take all 5 pitching categories every week, and then SB for hitters. That would give him 6 points a week (if it works out). He's basically punting HR, RBI, and potentially AVG and R.

Has anyone seen this strategy before? How has it played out? I have an idea for how to counter it, but I want to hear everyone's opinions.
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Postby Phatferd » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:25 pm

He won't do too well. Even the best pitchers have a handful of bad starts each year, so those weeks will kill him. Also, he really has 3 great pitchers in RJ, Pedro and Mariano...I am not sold on Pedro being a top 5 pitcher either this year, so I don't understand his strategy. He could have gotten pitchers like Pavano and Buerhle in mid rounds and in the meantime taken players like Ortiz, Tex, and MCabs and the likes in the 2nd, 3rd round areas.

I just don't get his strategy.
Last edited by Phatferd on Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby dellnet2000 » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:26 pm

Phatferd wrote:He won't do too well. Even the best pitchers have a handful of bad starts each year, so those weeks will kill him. Also, he really has 3 great pitchers in RJ, Pedro and Mariano...I am not sold on Pedro being a top 5 pitcher either this year, so I don't understand his strategy. He could have gotten pitchers like Pavano and Buerhle in mid rounds and in the meantime taken players like Ortiz, Tex, Cabbera and the likes in the 2nd, 3rd round areas.

I just don't get his strategy.


i agree
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Postby curious_george_43545 » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:27 pm

bad idea since what if your pitchers have a bad week?..there goes a few cats and your hitting won't win anything but maybe SB....Balance even in H2H....you can't afford to punt more than 1 cat in H2H.
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Postby BGbootha » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:27 pm

yeah it looks like the opposite of the LIMA strategy to a certain extent. The only problem with this is the consistancy of PIcthing in a H2H format.

In roto the pitchings cats are averaged out over a whole year, so a bunch of top flite pitchers like this will pretty much gaurentee you the pitching cats.

However in H2H, the pitching cats start anew every week, lets say Pedro goes out on Monday and gets bombshelled. (it may not happen alot, but it will happen) If he ends monday with 3 IP, and 8 runs, he is going to have an ERA of 24.00, and a whip somewhere comparable. Well even if he starts 6 more guys who all have quality starts he is going to put up comparable numbers and have to compete for those cats.

However, he will still be hurting in most of the hitting cats.
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Postby roadrunner » Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:57 pm

investing more than one pick on pitching in the top 6 rounds is not something i would advise. pitching truly is a crapshoot most drafts i don't take a pitcher until i'm convinced there is no one who will help more than a once every 5 day player left on the draft board, i almost always end up with this calibur of pitching by holding out:

buehrle
garcia
lilly
livan
webb
sabathia
weaver
etc..
and with the unpredictability of pitching usually i am able to hold my own for the season (H2H) i'm not saying i win those catagories all the time but it is enough to stay in the hunt

BUT i'll bet i always win runs, home runs, rbi, usually top 4 or 5 in avg. and depending on if i take a one catagory player IE. Podsednik, Sanchez, Pierre Etc usually dictates where i end up with steals

i can count on one hand in the last decade the #'s of times i have missed the playoffs with that strategy and i play from 4 to 6 teams a year

DISCLAIMER: this strategy will not work in rotisserie style, Pitching has a premium in that format, but IMO it is totally overated in 5x5 or 6x6 (H2H)
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Agree

Postby cinquad » Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:09 pm

I completely agree with the comments posted. I posted in my original post that I had been worried of collusion when I saw him drafting all pitchers. Those fears were dashed when I saw the quality of pitchers he was getting in those first few rounds...it had to be the work of one guy exclusively because no team of FB players could have opinions so wrong on those guys.

I'm still amazed that he didn't grab more than 3 closers if he was trying to dominate pitching cats...grabbing a guy like Gagne instead of Pedro in the 2nd would have been a wiser move. If he was going to dominate in SB, he also could have used that 2nd round pick on someone like Pierre or a later pick on Pods.

Jaret Wright and Pavano were such reaches...had he waited more rounds and picked hitters like suggested, he could have gotten guys like Doug Davis and Thomson in the 15-16th rounds, and I'm betting they'll have comparable numbers to Wright and pavano.

I'm in the league, and I think he could have dominant weeks with those guys, but he won't be able to sustain it over the season.
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Re: Agree

Postby curious_george_43545 » Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:26 pm

cinquad wrote:I completely agree with the comments posted. I posted in my original post that I had been worried of collusion when I saw him drafting all pitchers. Those fears were dashed when I saw the quality of pitchers he was getting in those first few rounds...it had to be the work of one guy exclusively because no team of FB players could have opinions so wrong on those guys.

I'm still amazed that he didn't grab more than 3 closers if he was trying to dominate pitching cats...grabbing a guy like Gagne instead of Pedro in the 2nd would have been a wiser move. If he was going to dominate in SB, he also could have used that 2nd round pick on someone like Pierre or a later pick on Pods.

Jaret Wright and Pavano were such reaches...had he waited more rounds and picked hitters like suggested, he could have gotten guys like Doug Davis and Thomson in the 15-16th rounds, and I'm betting they'll have comparable numbers to Wright and pavano.

I'm in the league, and I think he could have dominant weeks with those guys, but he won't be able to sustain it over the season.
;-D
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Postby Tavish » Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:31 pm

I think you hit the nail on the head as to the problem with how he carried out the strategy. If you are punting that many offensive categories you need to do everything you can to win every pitching category. Not getting another elite closer and trying to sneak SB out with a bunch of middle of the road hitters will definitely cause the guy problems IMO.
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Re: Agree

Postby giants8307 » Sun Mar 13, 2005 10:31 pm

curious_george_43545 wrote:
cinquad wrote:I completely agree with the comments posted. I posted in my original post that I had been worried of collusion when I saw him drafting all pitchers. Those fears were dashed when I saw the quality of pitchers he was getting in those first few rounds...it had to be the work of one guy exclusively because no team of FB players could have opinions so wrong on those guys.

I'm still amazed that he didn't grab more than 3 closers if he was trying to dominate pitching cats...grabbing a guy like Gagne instead of Pedro in the 2nd would have been a wiser move. If he was going to dominate in SB, he also could have used that 2nd round pick on someone like Pierre or a later pick on Pods.

Jaret Wright and Pavano were such reaches...had he waited more rounds and picked hitters like suggested, he could have gotten guys like Doug Davis and Thomson in the 15-16th rounds, and I'm betting they'll have comparable numbers to Wright and pavano.

I'm in the league, and I think he could have dominant weeks with those guys, but he won't be able to sustain it over the season.
;-D


Yeah, when I read about this, I was expecting an incredible staff. His picthing is nothing more than above-average IMO.
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