The evidence against bonds (a spinnoff of a previous thread)

[wrveres]

Lets have some fun eh'

Proof of number 1)
A)
1986 Barry enters the league at 185 lbs with a neglible percentage of body fat

in 2001 he enters the season at 230 pounds with neglible body fat

This is a medical impossibility without drugs. PARTICULARLY when he went from 200 in year 200 to 230 in 2001. He gained 30lbs in the offseason, without putting on body fat. This cannot be done, human chemistry does not allow it.

Wrong... Barry actually bulked up in fall of 1998 ..

Friday, February 26, 1999 -
Bonds reports to spring training bulked up, working his upper body more during the off-season, because of knee surgery. Nobody really notices or questions him, even in the wake of androstendione.

as a matter of fact going into 2001, he actually slimmed down.
"He's more flexible," said Shields, who's in his second season at Bonds' side. "He's not as big as he was when I got here, but he's more toned and more defined."

B)
Barry has taken steriods, even if he did it by "accident"

We've all read the clips, he has admitted to taking what his trainer gave him, which his trainer has since said was steriods.

(Oh, and it has NOTHING to do with the media, Im intelligent enough to form my own opinions thank you.)

umm apparently not.
This is not proof this is an opinion.
I might add that the story has never been collaborated, and no one has seen any published reports except form one spurned SF reporter who to this day, cannot back it up.

Proof of number 2)
To the following, I dont care what the question was, I dont care in what context it was given, you dont EVER SAY THE FOLLOWING if youre not a flaming racist.

- Boston is "too racist" for me to play in. (seriously, what in the world is up with that? Maybe the people in boston are too annoying, but racist? Come on)

apparently somebody doesn't know the History of Boston very well

I DONT CARE IF YOURE BLACK, I DONT CARE WHAT RACE ANYONE IS UNTIL THEY START TELLING ME THEY SUFFER BECAUSE OF THEIR RACE. I could list a THOUSAND more quotes by Barry to prove he's a racist -- this is the single most damning fact about him. He does more to hurt the black community than probably almost anyone alive today. A few of what I call "borderline" racists, see people like Barry, get angry, and assume other african-americans are like him. (theyre not). He makes a bad name for everyone.

there it is again, if you speak out about racism, you must be a racist, right?

[agchris02]

notice the sources at the bottom (of this and the above)
FACTS:

Barry gained 30 of those lbs in ONE OFF SEASON
WITHOUT gaining fat

Im currently looking for a source, I got the fact that this was impossible from a panel of doctors discussing the issue at Southwestern University. Virtually any dietition not employed by a gym will tell you the same thing. Some of us could do this, if we were horribly out of shape already, but not in that amount of time.

The following is quite interesting:

http://www1.ocdsb.edu.on.ca/srbhweb/mat ... o%2020.htm

The following is a site with all of Bonds stats, just look at them, he either hit an epiphany from 1996-2001 or found steriods. (look at the slugging percentage increase -- almost the highest in major league history)
http://www.baseball-reference.com/b/bondsba01.shtml


other interesting sources:
http://jeffbrokaw.net/archive1/000873.html
http://longgandhi.com/102502.html (read this)

[The Jury]

Another reason to hate on Barry is that that F---s up baseball cause he's a friggin insane hitter!!!!!!!

[wrveres]

FACTS:

Friday, February 26, 1999 -
Bonds reports to spring training bulked up, working his upper body more during the off-season, because of knee surgery. Nobody really notices or questions him, even in the wake of androstendione.

as a matter of fact going into 2001, he actually slimmed down.
"He's more flexible," said Shields, who's in his second season at Bonds' side. "He's not as big as he was when I got here, but he's more toned and more defined."

[agchris02]

Barry bonds testimony about using the substances:

http://www.zmetro.com/archives/001141.php

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6642400/

If you had bothered reading the document instead of spewing your skewed opinions, youd see that the reporter did not reveal his source.

Read what Bond's lawyer says, he says that someone leaked the testimony to smear Bonds, to discredit Bonds, to whatever
He NEVER denies that Bonds said that, and Bonds never denied he said it either

Is grand jury testimony supposed to be sealed? Of course it is, its illegal to unseal it. Thats why the reporter didnt reveal his source, the source would be arrested.

Barry took the "clear substance," his trainer said the "clear substance" was steriods --

This is testimony, made under oath, before a grand jury

Wheres the room for argument?

[agchris02]

one thing in his defense:

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/article ... 4103.shtml

his testimony should not have been leaked
But all that means is that we shouldnt have the proof that he "unknowingly" has used steriods, not that he hasnt used them

[agchris02]

more on why we know what Bond's testimony actually is:

http://talkleft.com/new_archives/009269.html
(again, i dont care how the story escaped though)

http://www.voanews.com/english/2005-02-23-voa47.cfm
-- notice Barry refused to deny, once again, that this was his actual testimony

[so0perspam]

How much of your life are you going to commit towards bashing Bonds? Grow up.

[agchris02]

I could counter with how much time are you going to defend him, but thats dumb

I just dont understand why so many people are so insistent that he didnt take steriods. Are people just that blind? If you like him fine, I dont thats a disagreement I can live with. I DONT understand an instistance that he never took steriods. Before the grand jury testimony leak, maybe there was a SMALL amount of room for discussion, now there isnt.

Ill be happy if everyone conceeds he took roids. Id even understand an argument that taking steriods wasnt cheating in the MLB at the time he did it. (Just like i DONT think big mac cheated in taking andro, it was legal at the time).

I will continue to argue the fact he did take them

Besides it gives me something to do during class and to avoid doing hw.

[DK]

Yawn....

lesgrant puts up a better argument than you, and that's not a compliment to anyone.

This debate is older than mud. Look up "Bonds" with my name in the search query to see my opinion.