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Keeper league with draft pick trading

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Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby mtdhv2 » Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:57 pm

12 team H2H, 4 keepers allowed, with draft pick trading allowed. I'm setting up the draft board and assigning keepers, but we are having a few problems:

1.) An owner that has multiple draft picks in a round is keeping a player from that round. Do I assign the keeper in the owners assigned slot, or the earliest slot possible in that round. For example, the owner has the 7th pick in round 4, but also traded and got another owners 3rd pick in round 4. The owner is keeping a player drafted in the 4th round. Which slot to assign that player to?

2.) An owner is keeping a player in round 8 but due to draft pick trading, has no 8th round pick. That keeper then gets pushed back to the 9th round correct? But, similar to the question above, what if that owner has two draft picks in the 9th round, which slot does that keeper get assigned to?

Thanks
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby RotoValue » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:45 pm

mtdhv2 wrote:1.) An owner that has multiple draft picks in a round is keeping a player from that round. Do I assign the keeper in the owners assigned slot, or the earliest slot possible in that round. For example, the owner has the 7th pick in round 4, but also traded and got another owners 3rd pick in round 4. The owner is keeping a player drafted in the 4th round. Which slot to assign that player to?

2.) An owner is keeping a player in round 8 but due to draft pick trading, has no 8th round pick. That keeper then gets pushed back to the 9th round correct? But, similar to the question above, what if that owner has two draft picks in the 9th round, which slot does that keeper get assigned to?

Thanks


1. Good question. I'd say choose either the earliest or latest pick in each round, but do this for all owners in such cases. Be consistent, but if you decide on earlier, definitely give the owner a choice not to keep the player, but instead to keep all the picks. But better to define first or last, rather than owner's, so that the rule is defined if an owner trades away his pick in round X but trades for two more picks in that round from other teams.

2. This is again a matter of how you want to define it - next pick after seems fairest. And to follow up with 1, a simple rule would be last pick in the same round, or the owner's next pick in any round after. If you want to take the first pick in a round, then it might make sense to take the previous pick if there are no picks in that exact round. But people probably want to keep their 1st round pick much more often than their last, so that's a reason to say that you forfeit the next pick after the round.

Ideally these rules would be agreed on in advance by all owners, before deciding on keepers. And how you define them opens up possible different strategies - if I know I'm keeping my 8th round pick from this year, then I may want to trade away that pick for next year's draft so I lose a less valuable pick!

But this sort of thing is another reason to try an auction with a keeper league: you then create contract rules for keeper auction prices, and then rather than worrying about what pick to take away, the owner's budget is simply reduced by the player's contract.
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby fsbarren » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:41 am

I have to admit, this is an entire new format for me, so I know very little about it. That being being said, shouldn't the owner's original pick in that round be the one to be taken before any others in that round? I would think that if an owner managed to get a replacement pick in that round via trade, then he should benefit from that and not have it taken away if he still has his original pick in that round.

Just my thinking, but if there is a rationale for doing otherwise, something new to learn.

Thanks.
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby Brainstorm » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:31 pm

1) I agree with the above poster, it doesn't matter which way you go, just be consistent.

2) I wouldn't move it down a round (ie. use a 9 instead of an 8). I would move it up a round, so use a 7 instead in this instance. Otherwise, you open yourself up to an owner purposely trading a pick away to enhance the value of a keeper. This an extreme example, but here goes: Guy is a 10th round pick but really a top 10 overall player, right. So team trades away 11th, 12th, 13th, and 14th round picks in deals and then uses a 15th rounder to keep this player. Then the year after, they're using a 15th rounder for that player.

Again, extreme example, but just showing how you can exploit yourself to a loophole. Make it a higher draft pick penalty if that round isn't available.
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby RotoValue » Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:11 pm

Brainstorm wrote:...This an extreme example, but here goes: Guy is a 10th round pick but really a top 10 overall player, right. So team trades away 11th, 12th, 13th, and 14th round picks in deals and then uses a 15th rounder to keep this player. Then the year after, they're using a 15th rounder for that player.


All the more reason to make it an auction-based league with a salary cap. Usually if you want to tie up a player, each extra year in the contract means extra salary in each year of the contract. So even if you were lucky enough to land Albert Pujols his rookie year for $1, you can't just lock him at that price, and the more years you lock, the more you have to pay each year.

My ever-so-slight bias in favor of going down the draft and not up came from what might happen if you wanted to keep a guy picked in the 1st round but traded away all your 1st round picks. Can you not keep him in that case? Or would you have to go to a second, or later pick?
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby mtdhv2 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:31 pm

RotoValue wrote:
Brainstorm wrote:...This an extreme example, but here goes: Guy is a 10th round pick but really a top 10 overall player, right. So team trades away 11th, 12th, 13th, and 14th round picks in deals and then uses a 15th rounder to keep this player. Then the year after, they're using a 15th rounder for that player.



All the more reason to make it an auction-based league with a salary cap. Usually if you want to tie up a player, each extra year in the contract means extra salary in each year of the contract. So even if you were lucky enough to land Albert Pujols his rookie year for $1, you can't just lock him at that price, and the more years you lock, the more you have to pay each year.

My ever-so-slight bias in favor of going down the draft and not up came from what might happen if you wanted to keep a guy picked in the 1st round but traded away all your 1st round picks. Can you not keep him in that case? Or would you have to go to a second, or later pick?



In the first case, we use what round the player was originally drafted. So say last year Pujols was drafted in the 1st round, but the owner keeping him doesnt have a 1st round pick, so he is kept in the 2nd round. So the next year, he isn't considered a 2nd round pick, he keeps his original draft value.

Each year you keep a player, he moves up one round in draft value, so it is similar in your auction format where his value increases each year. We however made the mistake by not implementing a rule on the amount of years that you can keep a player, thus, theoretically, someone keeping MIke Trout this year in round 20 and it taking 20 years for him to reach 1st round value. This won't likely happen but still.

Do you guys think it is too late to implement a maximum amount of years a player could be kept?
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby jefferey13 » Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:58 pm

mtdhv2 wrote:
RotoValue wrote:
In the first case, we use what round the player was originally drafted. So say last year Pujols was drafted in the 1st round, but the owner keeping him doesnt have a 1st round pick, so he is kept in the 2nd round. So the next year, he isn't considered a 2nd round pick, he keeps his original draft value.

Each year you keep a player, he moves up one round in draft value, so it is similar in your auction format where his value increases each year. We however made the mistake by not implementing a rule on the amount of years that you can keep a player, thus, theoretically, someone keeping MIke Trout this year in round 20 and it taking 20 years for him to reach 1st round value. This won't likely happen but still.

Do you guys think it is too late to implement a maximum amount of years a player could be kept?


So currently how do you lose a player? Can you only keep one first round pick? And if you have 2 players ranked round 1 at the same time you have to drop one? This seems like a bad idea, it was over values lower picks that can be kept for 20 years like you said, and then that player can use his first round picks on the dropped players. I would assign a max years to be kept. To keep my league simple we just have max years, no values.
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Re: Keeper league with draft pick trading

Postby Brainstorm » Thu Feb 21, 2013 7:40 pm

If you're going to do this, one of two things needs to be addressed:

-Max years you can keep a player
-Larger penalty each year for keeping, ie. 2 or 3 rounds instead of 1, or a hybrid thing, if player is drafted in x round or earlier, its a 1 round penalty, if drafted later its a 2 round penalty) Also, that should carry over from year to year. So say Trout was taken in the 20th round last year, to keep him this year could be an 18th, then a 16th next year, etc etc. Not revert back to the original round he was kept in.
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